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Author Topic: Federal Judge in Fla declares ObamaCare void and unconstitutional  (Read 13594 times)
sailor_tech
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« Topic Start: January 31, 2011, 04:47:15 pm »

Initial link via PajamasMedia: http://pajamasmedia.com/tatler/2011/01/31/breaking-federal-judge-in-fla-parts-of-obamacare-unconstitutional/

News site that broke it: http://www.sfexaminer.com/blogs/beltway-confidential/2011/01/breaking-federal-judge-rules-obamacare-unconstitutional

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The full text of the decision from Federal Judge Roger Vinson is not available yet, but according to reporters who've seen the decision, he's ruled the entire Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act unconstitutional. The ruling favors of the 26 state attorney generals challenging the law. The judge ruled the individual mandate that requires all Americans to purchase health insurance invalid and, according to the decision, "because the individual mandate is unconstitutional and not severable, the entire Act must be declared void."


apparent actual decsion up on ScribeD http://www.scribd.com/doc/47905280/vinsonruling1-31-11

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« Reply #1: January 31, 2011, 08:24:09 pm »


That's two for and two against. I assume we'll eventually see this one up at the USSC.
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« Reply #2: January 31, 2011, 08:33:41 pm »

That's two for and two against. I assume we'll eventually see this one up at the USSC.

Definately see it at the USSC.

Presumably the govt will ask for a stay of the judgement, which will be granted. Along with asking for expedited review by either the various appeals courts or the USSC.
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« Reply #3: February 20, 2011, 09:12:32 am »

Definately see it at the USSC.

Presumably the govt will ask for a stay of the judgement, which will be granted. Along with asking for expedited review by either the various appeals courts or the USSC.

It's going to get overturned in the end, because of the part of the bill forcing people to purchase health insurance, which would defeat the purpose of capitalism. I like parts of the bill, like the the pre-existing conditions part, because i have several major health problems that aren't my fault, because i was born with them, and I can't get health insurance on my own, unless I get on a group plan. But because of this bill i was able to get health insurance. I'm for it and against it, I just think they tried to throw something together was to quickly and didn't really take the time to make sure it was all good to go before passing the thing, now we are all gonna pay for it.
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« Reply #4: February 20, 2011, 09:46:01 am »

which would defeat the purpose of capitalism.

The purpose of capitalism? What would that be?
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« Reply #5: February 20, 2011, 10:10:48 am »

The purpose of capitalism? What would that be?


Free Market Enterprise, I'm a free market person, so anybody telling me I have to buy something goes against what I believe to be true capitalism. I'm not in anyway saying that everything in the bill is wrong, but forcing people to buy something just seems wrong to me. We live in a free country, at least I thought we did, and we should have the ability to choose to buy health insurance or choose not to buy it. This should be left to the consumer.
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« Reply #6: February 20, 2011, 10:37:21 am »

so anybody telling me I have to buy something goes against what I believe to be true capitalism.

True capitalism being...?

Because the western world has aspects of capitalism but is in general far more a judicial system, in which you rely on laws for basic things like protection. It is the judicial system that steps in to prevent fraud or monopolizing or other things that are, from a purely capitalistic point of view, very lucrative and effective.

(And capitalism can never be the ultimate answer, because money will never matter in the end, when you face life-or-death-situations.)
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« Reply #7: February 20, 2011, 12:02:44 pm »

Free Market Enterprise, I'm a free market person, so anybody telling me I have to buy something goes against what I believe to be true capitalism. I'm not in anyway saying that everything in the bill is wrong, but forcing people to buy something just seems wrong to me. We live in a free country, at least I thought we did, and we should have the ability to choose to buy health insurance or choose not to buy it. This should be left to the consumer.

Yes, but we don't have a pure free market. Never have.

The problem that I have with the health care bill is a requirement to buy insurance without a public option being available. What is currently a requirement is a huge boon to the insurance companies. Not the individual. Sad
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« Reply #8: February 20, 2011, 01:55:08 pm »

Yes, but we don't have a pure free market. Never have.

The problem that I have with the health care bill is a requirement to buy insurance without a public option being available. What is currently a requirement is a huge boon to the insurance companies. Not the individual. Sad

Yes, I know we don't have pure free market. I'm not saying having affordable health care is a bad thing. I'm just very weary of the govt. running health care. I don't want the govt. telling what i can and can't buy, thats taking freedoms away that we should have. Which is the right to choose.
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« Reply #9: February 20, 2011, 01:59:31 pm »

Yes, I know we don't have pure free market. I'm not saying having affordable health care is a bad thing. I'm just very weary of the govt. running health care. I don't want the govt. telling what i can and can't buy, thats taking freedoms away that we should have. Which is the right to choose.

Frankly, I have a hard time understanding this whole freedom and right to choose bit. From my perspective, my freedom is more restricted because a) I can't afford healthcare and b) even if I could, I would be I wouldn't be able to get it.

Since the insurance companies have made such a balls up of coverage, I'll be happy to see the government involved...they do a pretty good job of Medicare, which is what I'd really have preferred to see inacted.
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« Reply #10: February 20, 2011, 02:34:10 pm »


The problem that I have with the health care bill is a requirement to buy insurance without a public option being available. What is currently a requirement is a huge boon to the insurance companies. Not the individual. Sad

This.  Exactly.
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« Reply #11: February 20, 2011, 06:50:47 pm »

Yes, I know we don't have pure free market. I'm not saying having affordable health care is a bad thing. I'm just very weary of the govt. running health care. I don't want the govt. telling what i can and can't buy, thats taking freedoms away that we should have. Which is the right to choose.

the right to choose .. crushing debt for myself and my family or an early painful death?

Some choice.
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« Reply #12: February 20, 2011, 08:33:46 pm »

the right to choose .. crushing debt for myself and my family or an early painful death?

Some choice.

I don't suspect it takes much imagination to figure out my response to that. Having cancer that goes to stage 3 because I can't afford to see a doctor, have no insurance, and don't qualify for Medicaid means I just don't handle those sorts of comments too well. (And just in case the poster doesn't realize it, I, too, live in Texas so I'm REALLY aware of what's available to those of us who have no money and no health insurance.)

Oh. Yeah. And bankruptcy AFTER you get a lot of your tongue removed and spend two+ years getting over radiation treatments. But hey. At least I'm free.

Right.
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« Reply #13: February 21, 2011, 02:18:46 am »

I don't suspect it takes much imagination to figure out my response to that. Having cancer that goes to stage 3 because I can't afford to see a doctor, have no insurance, and don't qualify for Medicaid means I just don't handle those sorts of comments too well. (And just in case the poster doesn't realize it, I, too, live in Texas so I'm REALLY aware of what's available to those of us who have no money and no health insurance.)

Oh. Yeah. And bankruptcy AFTER you get a lot of your tongue removed and spend two+ years getting over radiation treatments. But hey. At least I'm free.

Right.

There aren't many occasions that I do actually mean this, but this is one of them- Thank the Gods that we have the NHS here. My private medical insurance won't cover me for some of my treatment as in their opinion 'it isn't helping the issue, it is just stopping it getting any worse. We don't do maintainance'. Try and figure that one out! I need the treatment to help me actually keep moving (literally). Yet, I can see the same specialist on the NHS and it is his opinion on thye issue that matters. He says I need the treatment, so I get it. Admittedly, it has taken longer to get it started, but now that it has, I don't have to keep going in circles. It gets done and then I am put straight back on his op list for when I am due again. No muss, no fuss. It isn't the best system of heathcare in the world, but it does work. Everyone is entitled to healthcare. Period.
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« Reply #14: February 21, 2011, 06:31:01 am »

I don't suspect it takes much imagination to figure out my response to that. Having cancer that goes to stage 3 because I can't afford to see a doctor, have no insurance, and don't qualify for Medicaid means I just don't handle those sorts of comments too well. (And just in case the poster doesn't realize it, I, too, live in Texas so I'm REALLY aware of what's available to those of us who have no money and no health insurance.)

Oh. Yeah. And bankruptcy AFTER you get a lot of your tongue removed and spend two+ years getting over radiation treatments. But hey. At least I'm free.

Right.

I was actually thinking of you and your situation when I posted that.  It's a choice .. but it's not one with any options that don't SUCK.
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