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Author Topic: The People vs. Goldman Sachs  (Read 22269 times)
sailor_tech
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« Reply #30: June 05, 2011, 03:18:06 pm »

So what is the difference between these guys, who are practicing economic terrorism against our country, and Manning? Or more specifically, what makes him deserving of extra-judicial action without a trial and them not?

Missing child support payments is not aiding and abetting the enemy, crashing our economic system is.

If I have to explain the difference between the two things to you, you are not worth the time needed.
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Owl
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« Reply #31: June 05, 2011, 03:37:38 pm »

So what is the difference between these guys, who are practicing economic terrorism against our country, and Manning? Or more specifically, what makes him deserving of extra-judicial action without a trial and them not?

Missing child support payments is not aiding and abetting the enemy, crashing our economic system is.

Treason while in the military carries different consequences.
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NyteShaed
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« Reply #32: June 05, 2011, 03:38:53 pm »

Treason while in the military carries different consequences.

Treason carries a death penalty for military or civilians.

I'm also fairly sure that members of the military are as entitled to a trial as civilians.
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NyteShaed
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« Reply #33: June 05, 2011, 03:39:23 pm »

If I have to explain the difference between the two things to you, you are not worth the time needed.

I'll take that as an admission that you are unable to explain the difference and concede that you are wrong.

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sailor_tech
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« Reply #34: June 05, 2011, 04:01:31 pm »

Treason carries a death penalty for military or civilians.

I'm also fairly sure that members of the military are as entitled to a trial as civilians.

No.
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sailor_tech
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« Reply #35: June 05, 2011, 04:03:37 pm »

Treason carries a death penalty for military or civilians.

I'm also fairly sure that members of the military are as entitled to a trial as civilians.

And I'll take this as an admission you have no idea what you are talking about with regards to legal procedures, the military or such.
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Owl
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« Reply #36: June 05, 2011, 04:16:40 pm »

And I'll take this as an admission you have no idea what you are talking about with regards to legal procedures, the military or such.


What he said.
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Ellen M.
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« Reply #37: June 05, 2011, 06:16:01 pm »

What he said.

Thirded.
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« Reply #38: June 06, 2011, 11:37:37 am »

No.

No, military members do not have the right to a trial?

That would explain why torturing Manning without a trial would be ok and doing the same to the Goldman sachs folks would not.

was that really so difficult?
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sailor_tech
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« Reply #39: June 06, 2011, 12:06:52 pm »

No, military members do not have the right to a trial?

That would explain why torturing Manning without a trial would be ok and doing the same to the Goldman sachs folks would not.

was that really so difficult?

You have a failure to read what was written. Members of the military are not entitled to trials as civilians. They are tried in military courts under the UCMJ, which if you had any clue as to the military or legal stuff you'd know.

And again, Manning is not being tortured.
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Owl
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« Reply #40: June 06, 2011, 12:07:20 pm »

No, military members do not have the right to a trial?

That would explain why torturing Manning without a trial would be ok and doing the same to the Goldman sachs folks would not.

was that really so difficult?

Basically, when you are in the military the government owns your ass.  And treason in the military is treated more harshly than treason by a civilian if they are lucky enough to be caught by police instead of the military.  
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« Reply #41: June 06, 2011, 12:11:05 pm »

You have a failure to read what was written. Members of the military are not entitled to trials as civilians. They are tried in military courts under the UCMJ, which if you had any clue as to the military or legal stuff you'd know.

And again, Manning is not being tortured.

I didn't say they were entitled to trial as a civilian.  I said they were as entitled to a trial as a civilian.  That extra as makes a big difference.

Manning was confined, without his clothing, without a trial.  If military members have the same right to a trial that civilians do  (iregardless of the fact that the trial is conducted in a different court and under a different set of laws) then there is no reason that the Goldman Sach's executives could not be held in the same manner pending a trial.
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LyricFox
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« Reply #42: June 06, 2011, 01:19:45 pm »

hout a trial.  If military members have the same right to a trial that civilians do  (iregardless of the fact that the trial is conducted in a different court and under a different set of laws) then there is no reason that the Goldman Sach's executives could not be held in the same manner pending a trial.

You are confusing a trial under the UCMJ rules/laws with a civilian/criminal trial under US federal or state laws.

The two are not the same thing. Goldman/Sachs executives cannot be tried by a military court, nor can the laws/rules of that court be applied to them. If Manning were to be tried in a federal/state court, he could expect different treatment and rules to apply.
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« Reply #43: June 06, 2011, 01:36:16 pm »

You are confusing a trial under the UCMJ rules/laws with a civilian/criminal trial under US federal or state laws.

I read the post of Nyteshead of requiring at least *some* trial on some court somewhere. Which court and which laws may vary, but it shouldn't go without any trial at all. (And if I misread it, I still think it is a valid point.)
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LyricFox
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« Reply #44: June 06, 2011, 01:38:59 pm »

I read the post of Nyteshead of requiring at least *some* trial on some court somewhere. Which court and which laws may vary, but it shouldn't go without any trial at all. (And if I misread it, I still think it is a valid point.)


I would  agree completely. It's one reason I've loathed that whole "enemy combatant" characterization of prisoners at Gitmo.
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