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Author Topic: Christian boot camp director and employee charged  (Read 10671 times)
EverFool
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« Reply #30: September 09, 2007, 03:11:35 pm »

I dunno, I think that was what made it so funny was that it was so ridiculous, and the way it archived that was through using the stereotypes. I mean, look at the camp itself it was unreal, very fake looking, so thus using stereotypes really highlights this.

I guess I'm just annoyed at gay stereotypes.  I think the silly course might have been funnier had the characters been played seriiously.  Then you could have had a more absurdist comedy. Smiley  I got a bit tired of gay men = effeminate and incompetent.
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« Reply #31: September 09, 2007, 03:15:25 pm »


I can see this, and understand it fully, I mean I do get quite annoyed at gay men are naturally effeminate. Personally though, I have had to learn when it was done sheerly for comedic purposes and not in a way of "haha look two straight dudes acting gay" but in a "haha look this is what they think of gays", sheer ignorance or cultural programming, comedic purpose in the haha two straight dude's acting gay, and in pure hatred. Where I live I have pretty much had to do this so I don't devolve into a puddle of sheer hate and rage, so mileage may vary here.
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« Reply #32: September 09, 2007, 03:19:54 pm »

I can see this, and understand it fully, I mean I do get quite annoyed at gay men are naturally effeminate. Personally though, I have had to learn when it was done sheerly for comedic purposes and not in a way of "haha look two straight dudes acting gay" but in a "haha look this is what they think of gays", sheer ignorance or cultural programming, comedic purpose in the haha two straight dude's acting gay, and in pure hatred. Where I live I have pretty much had to do this so I don't devolve into a puddle of sheer hate and rage, so mileage may vary here.

See, I can find straight guys acting gay funny.  In my eyes, it's not about hostility towards gay men, but about mocking each other, etc.  Based on those I've seen doing it, generally.  I find it more annoying when the film is obstensibly sympathetic to gay people.  I'm not even against having *any* stereotypes in a film.  I just like a little more range.  Lesbians came off better in that film, if only because the main character and her love interest were lesbians, and therefore got more character depth.

Still, it beats a lot of gay films/ tv etc.  Most of the time I just come to the conclusion that I'd never want to encounter people with personalities like that.  Queer as Folk (UK version.  Never seen the US one) wins a special prize on this one.  I pretty much hate nearly every single gay character in that program.
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« Reply #33: September 09, 2007, 03:28:02 pm »


Ah, I think I can now more fully understand what your saying. These shows marketed towards gays are using stereotypes when, out of everything, they should be showing more of a spectrum. Though granted I have never seen queer as folk, in fact I avoid a lot of shows marketed towards gays (except for a few movies on IFC). Unfortunately, the stereotype of a gay man is very effeminate and a lesbian is very masculine is an old one. It goes back to when homosexuality was first termed as such, in fact I think it started with Magnus Hirschfield and his idea of a "third sex". The sterotype has been self propigating from then on, man finds out he's gay and subconciously takes on this thought that well if other people knew then they would expect me to act effeminate so thus I will.

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« Reply #34: September 10, 2007, 02:48:05 am »


But it's not even like adoption of stereotyped behaviour is universal.  Plenty of people find other ways to express themselves.  You'd hope that eventually a little more nuance would appear in the media.
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« Reply #35: September 10, 2007, 07:09:10 am »


Your right, adoption of stereotyped behavior is not universal. though as far as media goes that's highly doubtful since the giant flamboyant queen makes for more sensationalist then your average joe who just happens to be gay.
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« Reply #36: September 10, 2007, 08:02:15 am »

But it's not even like adoption of stereotyped behaviour is universal.  Plenty of people find other ways to express themselves.  You'd hope that eventually a little more nuance would appear in the media.

Of course, Hollywood is known for stereotypes as characters, and not just of gay and lesbian characters: Pagans, priests, housewifes, etc.  Undecided
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« Reply #37: September 10, 2007, 12:33:49 pm »


Still, it beats a lot of gay films/ tv etc.  Most of the time I just come to the conclusion that I'd never want to encounter people with personalities like that.  Queer as Folk (UK version.  Never seen the US one) wins a special prize on this one.  I pretty much hate nearly every single gay character in that program.

I've never seen the UK version, but I loved the US one (well, I loved the one season of it I saw; we stopped getting Showtime  Tongue ).  Hal Sparks' character, Michael, was my favorite, I think, with Ted a close second.  Emmett and Justin were kinda stereotypical, but two outta five (six if you count Vic) isn't too bad, IMO, esp. seeing as I know guys like them.  Cheesy

And the US version had a disclaimer at the end of every episode: "Queer as Folk is a celebration of the lives and passions of a group of gay friends. It is not meant to reflect all of gay society."  Which, y'know, is something.  From what I've been told, they remade some of the characters, and some of the relationships between them, in a way intended to make it more acceptable to an American audience and, incidentally, make for more sympathetic characters.
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« Reply #38: September 10, 2007, 12:42:40 pm »

  From what I've been told, they remade some of the characters, and some of the relationships between them, in a way intended to make it more acceptable to an American audience and, incidentally, make for more sympathetic characters.

They also softened some plot lines.  In the US version I understand a character takes drugs, gets very ill, and then meets a nice doctor at hospital.  In the UK version he dies in his own home of the overdose, and doesnt get found for a couple of days.
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« Reply #39: September 10, 2007, 12:59:58 pm »


They also softened some plot lines.  In the US version I understand a character takes drugs, gets very ill, and then meets a nice doctor at hospital.  In the UK version he dies in his own home of the overdose, and doesnt get found for a couple of days.

That wasn't really necessary to make it acceptable here; we love a happy ending, but a lotta the cult classics don't have one.  I'm talking more about the way they changed Justin, f'ex.  In the UK version he was a 15 year old budding hedonist, yes?  In the US version he was a 17 year old artistic type.  Increasing his age made his relationship with Brian a lot more acceptable to an American audience, and making him less of a freakin' vamp made him more likable.  Michael's mom called him "Sunshine" and you couldn't help but like him in the US version.  FWIH that's not the case w/the UK version.

A guy dying at home of a drug overdose and not being found for a couple of days, while not normal fare on American TV at the time, would have been fine if done right.  A 29 year old man deflowering a 15 year old boy, and the 15 year old turning into, FWIH, a slut, would not be fine on American TV.  Everyone would be screaming about it.  Grin
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« Reply #40: September 10, 2007, 01:03:25 pm »


A guy dying at home of a drug overdose and not being found for a couple of days, while not normal fare on American TV at the time, would have been fine if done right.  A 29 year old man deflowering a 15 year old boy, and the 15 year old turning into, FWIH, a slut, would not be fine on American TV.  Everyone would be screaming about it.  Grin

The young character didn't quite turn into a slut per say, but was pretty close to it.  He only really got likeable again in the final episode.  The final episode of the UK version just about makes up for the shitty people in the other episodes.  I just can't make myself sit through several hours of hating people to get there though.

the straight characters in the series are pretty good.  Vince's mother (I'm not sure what the US name is, but he's the 'nice' one who likes the 'total bastard' one.) is fantastic.  'You know you're getting old when the drama queens are getting younger' Cheesy
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« Reply #41: September 11, 2007, 11:21:44 am »


the straight characters in the series are pretty good.  Vince's mother (I'm not sure what the US name is, but he's the 'nice' one who likes the 'total bastard' one.) is fantastic.  'You know you're getting old when the drama queens are getting younger' Cheesy

I'm guessing that would be Michael's mother, Debbie, in the US version.  The one taking care of her brother with AIDS, yes.  I loved her!  She was so funny and cool.  That's the kinda mom I'd wanna be if I had kids.   Cheesy

She was pretty friendly with Justin's mother in the US one, as I recall, and helped her to cope with her divorce when her husband turned out to be a bigoted bastard.
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« Reply #42: September 13, 2007, 11:46:39 am »

I'm guessing that would be Michael's mother, Debbie, in the US version.  The one taking care of her brother with AIDS, yes.  I loved her!  She was so funny and cool.  That's the kinda mom I'd wanna be if I had kids.   Cheesy

She was pretty friendly with Justin's mother in the US one, as I recall, and helped her to cope with her divorce when her husband turned out to be a bigoted bastard.

If I remember correctly, she was my favorite character when I watched that show.
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« Reply #43: September 13, 2007, 12:45:43 pm »

I'm guessing that would be Michael's mother, Debbie, in the US version.  The one taking care of her brother with AIDS, yes.  I loved her!  She was so funny and cool.  That's the kinda mom I'd wanna be if I had kids.   Cheesy

She was pretty friendly with Justin's mother in the US one, as I recall, and helped her to cope with her divorce when her husband turned out to be a bigoted bastard.

The AIDS and divorce plot aren't in the UK version.  However, she does give someone urine to drink at one point in the series, pretending that it's actual alcohol. Smiley
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« Reply #44: September 13, 2007, 01:02:23 pm »


However, she does give someone urine to drink at one point in the series, pretending that it's actual alcohol. Smiley

Heh, I've gotta ask; why?
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