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Author Topic: what do wiccans think about.....?  (Read 14680 times)
GI Jane
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« Topic Start: September 24, 2007, 10:03:14 pm »

what do wiccans believe as far as sex before marriage abortion gay marriage. things like that.
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Purplewitch
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« Reply #1: September 24, 2007, 10:09:18 pm »

what do wiccans believe as far as sex before marriage abortion gay marriage. things like that.

Depends if you want answers only from the Wiccans, or from the rest of us to.....?
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GI Jane
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« Reply #2: September 24, 2007, 10:14:15 pm »

any answers that i could get in general would be helpful. im very new to this type of religion and i havent been able to find many books at my local library. there are no stores local to me that sell them and the one mainstream store is very expensive so i have to wait a while before i can purchase any of them. i figured that i would consult with people who actually practice it first rather than a book.
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« Reply #3: September 24, 2007, 10:20:13 pm »

what do wiccans believe as far as sex before marriage abortion gay marriage. things like that.

I don't believe there is a set 'policy' on what wiccans are expected to believe on any of those things.  What individual wiccans believe will be whatever the individual wiccan you are speaking to believes, including you.  Since you have put wiccan in as your religion, what you yourself believe on those subjects is what at least one particular wiccan believes.

No central authority means you have the privilege and the duty of making up your own mind, through however much thought and discussion you feel the subjects require.

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« Reply #4: September 24, 2007, 10:21:22 pm »

what do wiccans believe as far as sex before marriage abortion gay marriage. things like that.

Wicca is about shared practices, not shared beliefs, so there's no single "Wiccans believe X".

That said, there are some common shared ethics that tend to lead in some common directions.

In part because of lines in the Charge of the Goddess (a common ritual text that many groups choose to use), many Wiccans don't place particular restrictions on sexuality (beyond mundane law and practical considerations.) Many do feel that sex in some way causes energetic ties or lasting connection with people, so that you shouldn't do it without consideration of that (but marriage isn't the dividing line: I've certainly run across people with a Wiccan influence who strongly prefer only to do handfastings or weddings for people who are sure they're sexually compatible - that generally means having sex before the commitment.)

In terms of GLBT acceptance on multiple levels - this is something that's shifted as cultural attitudes have shifted, and there's no particular barrier in any trad (except that some trads focus more heavily than others on a mythology that is heterosexual centered: this suits/works for some people - of whatever orientation - more than than others.)

How people approach gay marriage as a political issue depends on a lot of other factors: most folks I've come across thing some appropriate legal option is a good idea - but what people think the best choice/option/route to that might be varies. (As you might expect.)

Abortion is a little trickier: I know Pagan women who've had them. I know Pagan women who would never consider them. In the first case, in the cases I know of (which is a limited sameple), it's been  "As much as I would love this child, I am not in a place to take appropriate care of them: I have tried to take appropriate precautions: those failed." It's involved a re-evaluation of birth control options and choices for them, as far as they've said, but basically it remains  - like all Wiccan-based ethical issues - a matter of personal choice and ethics and acceptance of consequences.

Basic answer? All these choices have consequences. Wicca provides some ways to sort through the options and their consequences. It doesn't provide one single defined answer.
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« Reply #5: September 24, 2007, 10:38:27 pm »

what do wiccans believe as far as sex before marriage abortion gay marriage. things like that.

With the caveat that I'm not Wiccan.... as Marilyn and Jennet have said, being Wiccan won't necessarily tell you what to think, though it might give you guidelines, the final choice is your resposibility to decide what you think.

Obviously I don't have a problem with sex outside marriage because I have four children and have never been married, but at the same time, three of those were from inside a 16 year relationship, and the last is from my current relationship. And I consider that everyone, gay or straight has a right to get married of they so choose, or to remain unmarried and still be in a recognised stable long term relationship, if that is what they desire.

Abortion is something *I* personally could never do, but I've never condemned anyone for doing so, and I'd fight to uphold the right of it being an available choice for women everywhere - not least to stop the sheer nightmare that is 'backstreet abortions'. (My personal opinion - sections of American society can burn me alive if they wish Smiley )
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« Reply #6: September 24, 2007, 11:03:48 pm »

what do wiccans believe as far as sex before marriage abortion gay marriage. things like that.

I don't identify myself as Wiccan per se, but if you care for my rather controversial opinions - that of a Pagan woman- here goes:

Sex Before Marriage
I think everyone should have as much sex as they want, with respect to their personal health, the health of their partner(s) and honesty about expectations and boundaries for the relationship. I also don't think that marriage is an ideal or goal that *everyone* should strive. I think everyone should be free to choose for themselves the type of sexual and intimate relationships they want - celibate, promiscuous, monogamous, gay, straight and all points between.

That said, I am very old skool about it and prefer monogamy with a male partner.

Gay Marriage
I don't think the government has any business regulating human relationships, but until they stop doing so, I do think that everyone who wants to be married should be able to get married, regardless of sexual orientation.

Abortion
I don't think enough people have abortions. The ecosystems are clearly suffering from an over-abundance of humans. People who have no business having or raising children are guilted into having them when they accidentally get pregnant. As if being responsible for the care and nurturing of another human being is punishment for having sex.
If I got pregnant, I would not hesitate to have an abortion. I don't think fetuses are people with a soul until they draw their first unassisted breath. Until then, they are a parasitic clump of cells feeding off of their host. I see no ethical issues around having abortions. Hopefully, considering the expense and threat from crazy people who protest outside of clinics would cause women who have had an abortion to be more careful with their contraception, or opt for sterilization.
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GI Jane
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« Reply #7: September 24, 2007, 11:06:58 pm »

i finally feel like ive found somewhere that i can be home. where i can believe what i want and no one is going to critisize me and tell me im going to hell because i dont think the same as everyone else. the more i learn about this religion the more i feel that it suits me and its who i am.
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rose
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« Reply #8: September 24, 2007, 11:11:56 pm »

Until then, they are a parasitic clump of cells feeding off of their host. I see no ethical issues around having abortions.

hm, spoken like a person who has never had one. I am, btw, totally pro-choice, but there are a *zillion entirely personal ethical issues around having an abortion.
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Zerynthia
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« Reply #9: September 24, 2007, 11:16:12 pm »

spoken like a person who has never had one

Guilty as charged.
For others, I imagine there could be some issues, but for myself, I see no ethical issues to wrestle with.
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rose
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« Reply #10: September 24, 2007, 11:29:09 pm »

For others, I imagine there could be some issues, but for myself, I see no ethical issues to wrestle with.

Great. I sincerely hope that position is one you never have to reconsider.
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Goddess grant me:
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  The power of Fire,
  for the energy & courage to change the things I can.

  The power of Air,
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  And the power of Earth,
  for the strength to continue my path.

http://rosejayadal.blogspot.com/
Zerynthia
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« Reply #11: September 24, 2007, 11:38:15 pm »

I sincerely hope that position is one you never have to reconsider.

I was voluntarily sterilized a number of years ago so that I need not concern myself with contraception, emergency or otherwise or even abortion. But before sterilization, it was still a cut and dried issue for me which was not a secret between myself and my sexual partner(s).
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EverFool
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« Reply #12: September 25, 2007, 02:44:50 am »


No central authority means you have the privilege and the duty of making up your own mind, through however much thought and discussion you feel the subjects require.


Although it should be pointed out that Christians and members of other organised religions *also* vary in their beliefs.  Hence all the schisms and splits.

Other people can tell you what to think, but that doesn't mean your thoughts will suddenly reflect what they teach. Smiley
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Jenett
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« Reply #13: September 25, 2007, 08:00:11 am »

i finally feel like ive found somewhere that i can be home. where i can believe what i want and no one is going to critisize me and tell me im going to hell because i dont think the same as everyone else. the more i learn about this religion the more i feel that it suits me and its who i am.

I just wanted to clarify something, based on what you said above. It's not that you're going to avoid argument or disagreement - it's just that the arguments are different. People will have different interpretations of different teachings/approaches/common concepts within a practice. Some of those disagreements are civil (just like some disagreements within Christianity are civil), but some of them can also get nasty.

It's also a hard ethic in a lot of ways: there's no retreat if you get backed into a corner by something you think. That can be really uncomfortable if someone pokes at a place your logic isn't as sound, or where you were making a decision based on emotion, rather than thinking it through thoroughly. (And we all have stuff like that: just some people are more aware of their sore spots than others.)

It occured to me I didn't actually answer your questions for myself:

Sex outside of marriage: I'm in the "sex forms connections, those don't go away just 'cause you want them to" category: I'm unlikely ever to do 'casual' sex (outside the context of a committed relationship.) I don't think it's wrong or bad for other people to do so, but if they're people I care about, I'll probably have a conversation with them to make sure they're a) taking appropriate physical precautions and b) have given a little thought about the esoteric aspects (ongoing energetic ties.)

Abortion: Given my perfect world, contraceptive methods would work so well abortion wouldn't be needed (or very rare). What we've got is an imperfect world, so I'd prefer accessible abortions when needed to the alternative of children ending up unwanted and abused.

Gay marriage: I have bunches of GLBT friends. I want them to have the same legal rights (especially in terms of survivorship if one of a partnership is ill or dies) I (as a straight woman) get to have through marriage. I'm not fixated on which name gets attached to it: I'd be as happy with marriage being transferred to being the religious aspect (which individual religions get to decide their own rules for it, and there's a civic relationship-partnership term that does the secular side.) But I can see lots of ways the basic desire could be worked out.
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« Reply #14: September 25, 2007, 10:28:20 am »

what do wiccans believe as far as sex before marriage abortion gay marriage. things like that.

I’m not a Wiccan myself but I have studied the religion and I’ve never come across a central belief for these questions. But I personally believe that if you are a consenting adult (over 18 and of sound mind) you should be able to make a choice in how you conduct your life. I have no personal problem with gay relationships and find them to be just another expression of love. This day and age, sex before marriage is the norm and as long as you are consenting is alright by me. And abortion is a personal choice to be decided case by case (health of mother, health of fetus, ability to raise children, desire to raise children, etc.). Each person will have their own opinion with these topics but it won’t be something that is dictated by their religion [at least in the case of most Pagans].

i finally feel like ive found somewhere that i can be home. where i can believe what i want and no one is going to critisize me and tell me im going to hell because i dont think the same as everyone else. the more i learn about this religion the more i feel that it suits me and its who i am.

Pagan being such a large umbrella term means that you are going to come across a vast cut of people with varying ideas. This doesn’t mean that they are not going to argue with you but that the choice of things to argue about is much, much wider. You’ll actually be hard pressed to find two people who think alike. Like with any religion, it depends on the person themselves how they act with their beliefs.
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