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Author Topic: Chanting  (Read 10123 times)
NightPhoenix
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« Reply #30: October 12, 2007, 06:20:14 pm »

Well I'm not pagan, but in Greek Orthodoxy we have several different ways of chanting. One way is to chant to a particular melody either a common melody which can be used for many texts, or in some cases texts which have a totally unique melody only applied to that particular hymn.

Here's an example of melodic chanting to a very unique melody:

http://www.musicale.gr/_repository/ymnoi/sounds/19.wma


The second main type is simply intonation or ekphonetic chanting. This is the "simplest" in the sense a person can learn to do it pretty quickly. For people who aren't cantors or who aren't learning the art but simply want to chant at home, this is the best way of being able to do that pretty quickly. (within a few hours)

However like all Byzantine chanting, there is a true "art" to it when the real master cantors do it like this priest: (btw most priests are not cantors, finding a priest who can chant well is pretty rare these days)

http://www.analogion.com/Euangelion-Anastasews-Fr-Christos-Kyriakopoulos-CD-ELBYX_low.mp3


There are a couple of other styles, one sort of fitting in between these two styles, sometimes called "Chyma"...its chanting freely, but not too freely. Kind of hard to explain, and you'd have to hear it to get what I mean. Here's a live recording:

http://www.cmkon.net/music/NPsalmos_Patr_Choirs.rm



We have a whole host of melodies from sad, to slow, to happy and fast, to everything in between. Different hymns, or times of year call for different chants. And while our liturgies call for specific hymns at specific times, there is also a great sense of freedom when it comes to chanting in private prayer, meditation, or worship. Even in services, when I was first learning, it wasn't unusual to simply make up a melody to a text simply because I didn't know it, or didn't have the notation for it. (we don't use western staff notes, but a notation called "psaltic", and learning that is an enterprise unto itself)

Of course learning by ear is the best way to learn all the most popular hymns, such is this one:

http://graeca.canto.ru/upload/MontrealPsaltiki/Zoe_RomanosOMelodos/RM_Anastasis_003_ChristoAnesti.mp3


Sorry for them all being in Greek, but there isn't much good english chanting available on the net.

In the end, it's about chanting in a way that makes the text come alive for you. While each melody has a different "flavor" that matches what each hymn or text is talking about, its perfectly fine privately to chant in whatever way works for you.

Remember this is from an Eastern Orthodox POV, not a pagan one, but I think we have alot of things in common!



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Mithril
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« Reply #31: October 12, 2007, 06:52:47 pm »


Remember this is from an Eastern Orthodox POV, not a pagan one, but I think we have alot of things in common!

It's still really interesting. (and I agree, we do have a lot in common.) I'm glad there's another Christian on this board. You guys are really under-represented.
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« Reply #32: October 12, 2007, 09:36:38 pm »

However like all Byzantine chanting, there is a true "art" to it when the real master cantors do it like this priest: (btw most priests are not cantors, finding a priest who can chant well is pretty rare these days)

http://www.analogion.com/Euangelion-Anastasews-Fr-Christos-Kyriakopoulos-CD-ELBYX_low.mp3

Wow! That was very impressive.
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« Reply #33: October 13, 2007, 10:36:26 am »

I have an idea. What if I take my most favorite (and singable) melodies and put words to them? My skill as a composer isn't great enough to get the what I want on paper, but those few melodies are close enough to be really effective. Has anyone else done this?

I was thinking along this line also.  However, I was wondering if there wer some kind of musical copyright thing if they were to be used in a public ritual.  It probably wouldn't be a problem for old traditional tunes but more modern songs maybe?  Does anyone know about this?
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NightPhoenix
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« Reply #34: October 13, 2007, 12:04:11 pm »

It's still really interesting. (and I agree, we do have a lot in common.) I'm glad there's another Christian on this board. You guys are really under-represented.

Thanks, I'm glad to be here! Seems like a great community!
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« Reply #35: October 13, 2007, 12:58:51 pm »

I was thinking along this line also.  However, I was wondering if there wer some kind of musical copyright thing if they were to be used in a public ritual.  It probably wouldn't be a problem for old traditional tunes but more modern songs maybe?  Does anyone know about this?

It's a good idea to assume that anything written since about 1923 is probably copyrighted. There are some exceptions, but that's the safest bet.

It gets a little trickier in terms of Pagan chants (i.e. stuff people within the broader Pagan community have written for use in ritual.) Many people have deliberately shared them, wanting them to be used (or being aware that once they're used within a community, they might well spread.) There's also a fair bit of mislabelling in a few cases, on who actually wrote what. I'd be wary of re-using tunes: some of the tunes come from folk song resources (i.e. pre-1900s), but not all do.
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« Reply #36: October 13, 2007, 10:17:50 pm »

Well I'm not pagan, but in Greek Orthodoxy we have several different ways of chanting.

* snip *

Remember this is from an Eastern Orthodox POV, not a pagan one, but I think we have alot of things in common!







Thank you so much for that post! Byzantine chant is just amazing.
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NightPhoenix
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« Reply #37: October 14, 2007, 03:46:04 pm »



Thank you so much for that post! Byzantine chant is just amazing.

You're welcome! And I agree whole heartedly! Smiley
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juniperrr
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« Reply #38: October 16, 2007, 01:29:24 pm »


As a musician who's now down both Catholic and Pagan musical settings, I'd also feel really uncomfortable with someone taking music I wrote specifically for one religious community, and turning it to another.

I feel the same about classic Christian Hymns. What particularly bothers me about the chants I have heard that are Christian with Goddess names inserted where "Jesus" or "The Lord" would be is religious more than anything else. My personal theology is very, very different from a Christian POV. My worldview is not Christian with a God - in - Drag. It is fundamentally different and therefore such Goddessized Christian hymns, as lovely as they are, feel fundamentally wrong for me. A personal thing, I agree.
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« Reply #39: October 24, 2007, 01:40:42 pm »

I feel the same about classic Christian Hymns. What particularly bothers me about the chants I have heard that are Christian with Goddess names inserted where "Jesus" or "The Lord" would be is religious more than anything else. My personal theology is very, very different from a Christian POV. My worldview is not Christian with a God - in - Drag. It is fundamentally different and therefore such Goddessized Christian hymns, as lovely as they are, feel fundamentally wrong for me. A personal thing, I agree.

"Christian God in Drag"? Fabulous, mind if I borrow it?

I agree...I think it makes people more comfortable to substitute the names, but really they are kidding themselves...

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« Reply #40: October 24, 2007, 03:51:07 pm »

"Christian God in Drag"? Fabulous, mind if I borrow it?

Oh, not at all. I just wrote it but I cannot believe it's the first time the comparison has been made.  Smiley
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Star
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« Reply #41: October 24, 2007, 03:52:50 pm »

Oh, not at all. I just wrote it but I cannot believe it's the first time the comparison has been made.  Smiley

I don't think it is; I'm sure I've seen the phrase used before.
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« Reply #42: October 24, 2007, 04:50:06 pm »

It's still really interesting. (and I agree, we do have a lot in common.) I'm glad there's another Christian on this board. You guys are really under-represented.

 Christian here2!!! im officially christian, but i practice shamanism and paganism, I had an "nonreligious" marriage, and  and neither I have a christian view of the world. I got some budist practics too, and  until now everything works perfectly Cheesy
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« Reply #43: October 27, 2007, 08:30:54 pm »

Damn I wish I had a mic, I'd record some of mine for you.

I've been told you can stick a pair of headphones in the mic port on your computer and use them for a mic, but I've never tried it myself.  Roll Eyes
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« Reply #44: October 29, 2007, 10:47:41 am »

Maybe this is a stupid question, but how do you chant something? Do you randomly make up a stepwise, flowing melody, or do you sing mostly in a monotone?
nothing stupid about the question. I just sort of let it flow, or I start chanting in Oneida or other Native American Chants I've learned over the years. I don't do monotone anything so for me its just a matter of starting to chant, it will go where it wills. The hypnotic effect of chanting is sort of a bonus because chanting tends to get you in a half trance state, just like playing in a drumming circle does. I wrote a couple  of chants a few years ago for my circle, words spoken in a singsong for power raising and they are very powerful though simple chants. You might try something like that. think about a sentence that rhymes and says what you want then keep repeating it to build the power associated with it. don't worry about monotone- if it wants to go there it will. main thing is just to relax
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