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Author Topic: How many of you started your own tradition?  (Read 18803 times)
PNorwood
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« Topic Start: October 27, 2007, 12:34:12 pm »

just for s&g I thought I'd take a poll of all us newbies and full members at TC. I am one who started my own trad over 25 yrs ago and it is a rather eclectic one using fam trad stuff and elements from Wicca, Native American and Celtic/Druid
How about you?
White Raven
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« Reply #1: October 27, 2007, 12:45:01 pm »

just for s&g I thought I'd take a poll of all us newbies and full members at TC. I am one who started my own trad over 25 yrs ago and it is a rather eclectic one using fam trad stuff and elements from Wicca, Native American and Celtic/Druid
How about you?
White Raven

I suppose I qualify. I have my own gods. (All the established pantheons rejected my application.  Wink )

I don't think of it as a trad, because there are no defined practices.
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« Reply #2: October 27, 2007, 12:57:54 pm »


I started my own religion.  It's called FlameKeeping.

and it's got bits and pieces from all over the place. Smiley
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« Reply #3: October 27, 2007, 01:07:45 pm »

just for s&g I thought I'd take a poll of all us newbies and full members at TC. I am one who started my own trad over 25 yrs ago and it is a rather eclectic one using fam trad stuff and elements from Wicca, Native American and Celtic/Druid
How about you?
White Raven

I did too. Pathway of the Gods draws on practices from ancient Rome and I largely follow the Roman and Celtic pantheons.
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« Reply #4: October 27, 2007, 05:08:04 pm »

just for s&g I thought I'd take a poll of all us newbies and full members at TC. I am one who started my own trad over 25 yrs ago and it is a rather eclectic one using fam trad stuff and elements from Wicca, Native American and Celtic/Druid
How about you?
White Raven

I started off creating a 'tradition' I suppose, (Dryadic Paganism) but pretty much as soon as I outlined the where when why who hows, wrote a 20,something thousand word book on it had a D'oh moment.  Burried the text in my computer memory somewhere and am still in many ways rather embarassed about my intentions when writing it. 

I thought I could simplify someone elses journey.  Break it into bite sized chunks, tell them something that they would have to work long and hard to learn on their own and it would save them some of the crash and burns and some of the painful lessons.  That and I really at that point felt that validity awaited in structure and buy in.  When I had a structure and others bought in, I would be valid.  Others would see how incredibly smart I was and through their belief in my competence I could believe I was competent.

What happened.

When on a journey, you only have so much fuel for fire.  The time it was costing me to build signal fires for others to 'maybe someday kinda sorta copy/follow/believe in' was taking too many of my resources and not bringing any in. 

My time, my energy and my effort was all based upon the assumption that someone would want to 'follow my path' without much consideration for the path being one that was about walking.  Leaving a trail was taking away from the ground I could cover, because when it came down to it, there were some things that just defied describing.  Things that I can only still sometimes shrug and say, you don't get it, and there's no way I can word it that it will get through the way I mean it. 

Should you have a day that I'm not on your best buds list, you can take how you feel about me, project it onto what I have shown you, or tried to show you and repaint a pretty ugly picture using all of my own words.  This of course works the other way around too.  Should you admire me, desire to be where I am, attain a point of what you assume is completion, then you will buy into what I am doing to gain validation from me. 

If every lesson I ever learn, I put to words and hand you on a silver platter, then I cheapen the knowledge.  I make it something that took me hard knocks and life lessons to gain and make it something you can pick up, agree with, put in your pack and go along your merry way, richened but unchanged.  You also take a bit of my fuel with you.  Something that I'm not necessarily willing to give away.  There are strings and cords there, that may prove undesirable at a later time.

The path I walk is about change, and becoming limitless.  I can't take away another persons limits.  That's something they have to do themselves.

Don't get me wrong, I do see the purpose of traditions in ritual and worship.  A sense of community is a great thing.  For me though, faith is for the most part about walking away from what others want to be, and looking at what I am. 
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« Reply #5: October 27, 2007, 06:03:56 pm »

I don't really understand these "traditions" thing. Are there only Wiccas that have traditions? Or also other pagen forms of belief? I understand, by founding a Tradition, one puts up rules that other people should follow. Or - Tradition means, that the skills are handed over in a family from one generation to another. Well, my 3 grown up sons would declare Mom a completely fool - and - besides, they are going their own spitirual way.

Why should somebody want other people to follow their path? This leads to form of religions like Katholics -the Pope in Rome is "embodied" figure of such a "Tradition".

Talking and sharing experiences - reading and learning - all this can be done without being part of a Tradition.

I agree with Mandi:
A sense of community is a great thing.  For me though, faith is for the most part about walking away from what others want to be, and looking at what I am.    Cheesy

B.B.
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« Reply #6: October 27, 2007, 09:24:59 pm »

Are there only Wiccas that have traditions?

Any religion can be or become a religious tradition.  The term "trad" means different things depending on who you ask, though.

Quote
Why should somebody want other people to follow their path? This leads to form of religions like Katholics -the Pope in Rome is "embodied" figure of such a "Tradition".

Not everyone wants to develop their own religion.  Not everyone wants to practice a solitary path.  I'm not sure what Catholicism has to do with anything (or the Pope, for that matter).  You seem to be equating rules and structure with tyranny (and, worse yet, implying that Catholicism is a tyrannical religion).  I don't think you're going to get much support for this point of view.
Quote
Talking and sharing experiences - reading and learning - all this can be done without being part of a Tradition.

It's wonderful that you've found something that works for you.  Why dismiss people who believe/feel differently about these things, though?  Just because it doesn't work for you doesn't mean it can't work for someone else.

Brina
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« Reply #7: October 27, 2007, 09:25:33 pm »

I don't really understand these "traditions" thing. Are there only Wiccas that have traditions? Or also other pagen forms of belief?

The answer to that depends on who you ask.  You might want to have a look at this thread:
http://www.ecauldron.net/forum/index.php?topic=817.0

By the way, could you please remember to use the quote/reply function to reply to posts?  It really helps the rest of us follow the conversation.  Smiley  (You can find more information about our quoting policy by clicking here, and of course if you have any questions, feel free to ask.)
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« Reply #8: October 27, 2007, 11:29:57 pm »

just for s&g I thought I'd take a poll of all us newbies and full members at TC. I am one who started my own trad over 25 yrs ago and it is a rather eclectic one using fam trad stuff and elements from Wicca, Native American and Celtic/Druid
How about you?
White Raven

I guess I would also sort of qualify. My own tradition is based on research, experience, exploration, etc over the last decade or so. It is constantly changing, I go where I feel I should go. It seems to be a mixture of a lot of Celtic Recon and Druidry beliefs with a mix of Green/Kitchen Witchery, Hinduism, Buddhism, Kabbalah and a few others, its very nature oriented though. As for a view of the Divine, I really don't have one. I think whatever the Divine is, whether it be one god/dess, many, big ball of energy, etc...) I choose not to judge for myself what it is. Who am I to judge, especially on something I can not fully understand.

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« Reply #9: October 28, 2007, 05:52:09 am »

The answer to that depends on who you ask.  You might want to have a look at this thread:
http://www.ecauldron.net/forum/index.php?topic=817.0

By the way, could you please remember to use the quote/reply function to reply to posts?  It really helps the rest of us follow the conversation.  Smiley  

I read through the quoting rules and, if I understood it correctly, will improve on this. Sorry and thanks for the hint.

Also I checked out the porposed thread. Well, didn't read it through all way down. But - maybe I understand under "tradition" something different than you guys.

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« Reply #10: October 28, 2007, 06:16:07 am »


I'm not sure what Catholicism has to do with anything (or the Pope, for that matter).  You seem to be equating rules and structure with tyranny (and, worse yet, implying that Catholicism is a tyrannical religion). 
Why dismiss people who believe/feel differently about these things, though? 
Brina

Hi Brina,

My understanding for a "religious tradition" is the Catholicism. Of course, there are others. My reply was emotional based and refers to that. I have a long experience with this religion and there is a deep angryness in my heart. I was grown up catholic, spent 4 years behind the walls of a cloister and personally believe, that this religion used tyranny, fear and persecution to their own benefit. This religion has, to my opinion, nothing to do with Jesus mission nor with what God would like us to be. Of course, there are wonderful people among Catholics, but the structur of this religion seems to me tyrannical.

Tradition, to my understanding, needs a person that is the "founder / leader / guru" with pretention of impeccability (= for example the Pope in Rome).

A better description seems to me "path". Tradition, in my ears, has to do with rules and structure. Honestly, I never met a "tradition" where all rules and structures fit for me. The rules and structures are menmade and - maybe - do not help someone to improve spirituality. A path seems more applicable. A path implicates the possibility of a stop, of a little loopway, the one that is following the path looks up to the same goal, but has to watch where to step by himself.

Hope, I could make myself understand.

..... and sorry if I hurt someone's feeling. That "tradition"-thing just makes me feel falling back to the darkness. Huh

Silberschein
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« Reply #11: October 28, 2007, 09:35:28 am »

just for s&g I thought I'd take a poll of all us newbies and full members at TC. I am one who started my own trad over 25 yrs ago and it is a rather eclectic one using fam trad stuff and elements from Wicca, Native American and Celtic/Druid

I suppose FilĂ­ocht is a tradition, in a way. It branches off of Celtic paganism and filidecht, "poetcraft" of the ancient Irish filid. Kind of my own brand of filidecht, I guess.
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« Reply #12: October 28, 2007, 12:51:20 pm »

Tradition, to my understanding, needs a person that is the "founder / leader / guru" with pretention of impeccability (= for example the Pope in Rome).

It's an issue of specalised terminology.

Within some specific settings, there *are* specific usages for the term tradition (used as a parallel to 'denomination' within Christianity.)

People define it different ways. One of the more common is that it needs to be able to survive the founder: a common way that's defined goes like this.

Person A comes up with a pattern of practice and other elements that work for them. They eventually teach it to person B, and person B goes off and forms their own group using the same core practices and methods (and to some extent, beliefs, though most Wiccan and Wiccan-influenced traditions are more explicitly about shared approaches than shared beliefs.) When Person B teaches Person C all those things, and person C is able to start *another* group in that set of practices, then you've got a tradition.

By that model, the way it's being used in this thread would be a bit imprecise: someone who comes up with their own path, but doesn't share it directly with others won't have it survive them. If they do share it, with people learning precisely what makes up that set of practices (as opposed to chatting, and incorporating things that make sense to them as individuals), you still need one more 'generation' to be sure it will really survive the founder.

I'm in the process of 'hiving' (forming my own group) within the path I belong to. I'm going to be the first person to do so amicably.

I started my training about 4 years into the existence of the group (now turning 11) so I've actually had a fair amount of input into some aspects of the shared group work. But there are a number of things I want to adjust about group work, partly because I intend a different kind of focus, but there are also core elements of the path that I want to keep. (And that we're talking about exactly what those are.) But I don't believe it'll be a full-fledged tradition until I (or someone else who hives) trains students to the point that they can go and found a group within the path.

Until then, I do use the term 'tradition', because it's pretty clear we're going to survive our founder at this point - but I use 'path' for my own personal practice, and use it by default for anyone whose practices are still centered on them, rather than being shared/taught to others directly and systematically.

Incidentally, in our group, we have many different beliefs about some things - the person I'm closest to, as a friend, and I have *seriously* different takes on the nature of deity. It doesn't matter in ritual, because we have shared agreements about how we approach certain things. We both get things out of the experiences.
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« Reply #13: October 28, 2007, 04:26:13 pm »

How about you?

I suppose I count, as the path that I follow, to the best of my knowledge, did not exist previously to my creation of it. However, as the defining aspect of my path is that it is the journey that matters, not the destination, I cannot really call what I do a tradition. My path is constantly evolving and will be until I am no longer here to evolve it. I will never get to a point where I have found the totality of my tradition or have finalized any aspect of it and I therefore cannot truly call it a tradition.
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« Reply #14: October 28, 2007, 05:35:02 pm »

How about you?

My path isn't really new at all, I worship the entire Hellenic Pantheon. Though the way I work with my deities and my beliefs are very un-hellenic.

I talk to my gods, alot; and try to do my fair share of listening as well. I don't use rituals or chants or even the typical idea of prayers; I just talk, as if they were standing right beside me. Do I do it with all the Hellenic deities? Heck no. A fair share of them? You bet. Most of them don't seem to mind, and some of them seem to enjoy that form of communication rather than, "O Great Golden One, I beseech you to... (insert verb and noun here)" Which happens to be where my nick-name for Apollo comes from. There are those that I give the upmost respect to, Zeus, Hera, etc.; because that's what they ask for.

Rituals are not part of my day to day work, in fact the past few times I've tried to have a ritual offering for the deities I was almost lit on fire. (Twice! $#!%) So rituals are no longer a big part of my path, because I'd rather not have to go to the ER and explain to the doctor I was making offerings to pagan gods and goddesses. (And they didn't like it so they lit my rug on fire.) Now I bake cookies and other tidbits for my deities, and give them as an informal offering; left outside. (Oddly enough once I've set it out there I never see it again.)

I have very specific ideas about the value of life and how people's priorities should be in order, and they tend to be much closer to what I've known to be Buddhist ideals. But my devotion to my god keeps me with him instead of off pursuing Buddhism, so I've yet to explore it as another avenue of my faith. Though eventually I may incorporate more of it into my daily life.

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