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Author Topic: Wicca 404: Advanced Goddess Thealogy  (Read 12579 times)
sefiru
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« Reply #45: May 08, 2008, 10:06:15 am »

I've read fanfic too in my trekkie-phase, to be honest, I've written some, heterosexual though *cough*.

To be fair, the stories I was referring to are not explicit at all. Now, the stuff I've written, on the other hand ...
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SunflowerP
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« Reply #46: May 08, 2008, 10:17:04 pm »

Not sure if you'll like that source, but Peter David uses the same pronouns in his Star Trek - New Frontier novels. He has a hermaphrodite character in them. But I've no idea where he has the pronouns or the idea from.
That series postdates my construction by about 5 years.  'Course, he may have been using the system in other, earlier books as well.  It's possible his source eventually traces back to me; I was using them on the CitadelNet (a non-InterNet computer network, back in the day when the Internet wasn't the only network) and quite a few folks liked them and took to using them as well - or he could have got them elsewhere, or come up with them himself.  They seem to me to be sufficiently obvious constructions that independent invention is perfectly possible; I've just never run across evidence of it that stood up under scrutiny.

About 75% of the times when someone has said to me, "Oh, I've seen that system before," it's turned out that what they mean is, they've seen the idea of gender-neutral singular pronouns, and aren't making a distinction between different specific systems, or are supposing that a single shared term means the systems are the same.  So I've learned to double-check even with people I think of as quite reliable (like you!):  are you certain all David's pronouns match mine?

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« Reply #47: May 08, 2008, 10:29:21 pm »

There's also the zie/zir variant, which I like quite a bit.

There's a bunch of other variants listed in the Wikipedia article at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender-neutral_pronoun - many of which I've never seen in action (and I spend time in areas where gender neutral pronouns are not uncommon.)
Yep, I've seen a number of archives recording a whole bunch of different systems (I think I may have found them by following the external links in the Wikipedia article) - I was poking into the subject only a few months back.

I've taken to using my system for "unknown person of unknown gender", while favoring zie/zir for a specific person of indeterminate or nonstandard gender, since many genderqueer folks seem to prefer the latter - a different set of pronouns for each really isn't necessary, but I like the nuance made possible by distinguishing between the two.

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Waldfrau
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« Reply #48: May 09, 2008, 02:49:33 am »

So I've learned to double-check even with people I think of as quite reliable (like you!)
Thanks. *blush*

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are you certain all David's pronouns match mine?
No, I haven't read him since a while. I just thought you might be interested in knowing where something like this turns up (though SciFi in general isn't too hard a guess). If you're interested in researching how he uses them and where he got the idea I think there's loads of info and reviews on the net as he's one of the popular Star Trek authors (and there's lots of fan info about ST on the net in general).
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« Reply #49: May 11, 2008, 01:48:18 am »

No, I haven't read him since a while. I just thought you might be interested in knowing where something like this turns up (though SciFi in general isn't too hard a guess). If you're interested in researching how he uses them and where he got the idea I think there's loads of info and reviews on the net as he's one of the popular Star Trek authors (and there's lots of fan info about ST on the net in general).
<chuckle> And that's exactly how it happens, and why it can happen that way with otherwise-reliable people.

You're right that I was interested in knowing about it, especially since he's not a source anyone has mentioned before, but I don't think I'm interested enough to research it in detail - it sounds like something I'd have to read a lot of other info to find the relevant bits.  Still, yes, I'm glad you mentioned it.

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« Reply #50: May 14, 2008, 07:50:44 am »

Still, yes, I'm glad you mentioned it.
Glad it wasn't a complete shot into the blue. I'll come back to this if I happen to find out more about it, but at the moment I have no time for Star Trek.
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