Cunningham-What's the problem?

The Cauldron's server is expensive and requires monthly payments. Please become a Bronze, Silver or Gold Donor if you can. Donations are needed every month. Without member support, we can't afford the server.

Or donate directly via Paypal

This message board is The Cauldron: A Pagan Forum's SMF Archive Board. It is closed to new memberships and to posting, but there are over 250,000 messages here that you can still search and read -- many full of interesting and useful information. (This board was open from February 2007 through June 2011).

Our new vBulletin discussion board is located at http://www.ecauldron.com/forum/ -- if you would like to participate in discussions like those you see here, please visit our new vBulletin message board, register an account and join in our discussions. We hope you will find the information in this message archive useful and will consider joining us on our new board.

[Waldfrau]

One of the major misconceptions I've seen about The Spiral Dance is that Starhawk was talking about Wicca.

Oh yeah, I ran into Sine with that one. 

[Isis]

I have books from varying authors (sadly, Ravenwolf is one of them; I was 17 and at 27 have learned my lesson by now).  I have one or two Cunningham books, one from Moura (I think that's her name -- Green Witchcraft is the book -- as well as Dorothy Morrison.

I think finding a book that's easy for you to read (where your eyes aren't going to glaze over) is a great place to start.  One has to be sure the book is going to keep their attention.

I like Cunningham; as others have stated, his books are a good jumpstart for others.

[Waldfrau]

Starhawk's history is, well, very dated. As are some of her political takes (these are more obvious in the revised version, but because of the way she did the revisions - i.e. with annotations following the original text, which I otherwise think is a pretty cool thing - it's not always immediately obvious.) A lot of people also have some issues with her general political bent, which is still very present in the 20th anniversary edition (most of the complaints I've seen center either on the politicisation of the issue, or in some cases in discomfort with certain aspects of the feminist push in there.)

I found her rather opinionated too, but sorted that stuff just into the 'personal opinion of the author box'. I'm not sure yet if I understand how her path is linked with this political stuff or if you can practice Reclaiming without it. Normally I draw a line between religion/spirituality and politics, so it was interesting to read a book by someone with a different take.

I still think it's a good book, and very worth reading - but I think it's not the same book she'd write starting from scratch right now. It's just not the first book I'd suggest to someone starting out. Or even in the first five, because I think it's more use to be talking about other topics first.

I like some of the exercises and suggestions, but I'd like to read some different books to have a comparison. I find it hard to get any overview about Witchcraft or even just about Wicca and Wicca-derived paths. Maybe I'll read Hutton's Triumph of the Moon next or Elements of Ritual by Lipp.

I wonder, Jenett, which first 5 books would you recommend for a start?

http://www.twpt.com/drawingdownthemoonspotlight.htm has an interview with her that talks about some of this in more detail.

Thanks, I'll come back to this later.

[Jenett]

I found her rather opinionated too, but sorted that stuff just into the 'personal opinion of the author box'. I'm not sure yet if I understand how her path is linked with this political stuff or if you can practice Reclaiming without it. Normally I draw a line between religion/spirituality and politics, so it was interesting to read a book by someone with a different take.

My take on it (I'm familiar with our local Reclaiming community, was part of a project run under their umbrella, though many of the other participants weren't Reclaiming folk either, and have had lengthy conversations with several people in it, but it's not where I spend much time) is that the political bit is a constant undercurrent.

However, how that manifests for particular people and situations varies a whole lot - some people do small things through their life (recycling, daily choices), and some people are more devoted to various big causes. Personally, I've found the Reclaiming things I've done at the edge of my comfort level for structural reasons, not political-focus ones, but I freely admit I prefer structure (and specific kinds of structure, in particular). That said, I've *liked* all the serious Reclaiming folk I know as people, and as witches, and enjoy conversations and interactions with them a lot; they have not been people who only talk about politics, or who expect everyone to take their exact same views.

I like some of the exercises and suggestions, but I'd like to read some different books to have a comparison. I find it hard to get any overview about Witchcraft or even just about Wicca and Wicca-derived paths. Maybe I'll read Hutton's Triumph of the Moon next or Elements of Ritual by Lipp.

Hutton - and Hesleton - are fantastic views of the history. Both _Elements of Ritual_ and Amber K's _RitualCraft_ give some interesting approaches to ritual structure and design.

I wonder, Jenett, which first 5 books would you recommend for a start?

Exactly what I'd recommend depends on someone's specific interests - but you can see a discussion over on my website here that I posted about a month or two ago. http://gleewood.org/threshold/fyi/books-introductory-works/

Briefly, for *Wicca* (and one of the issues with Starhawk's work is that she's talking about Reclaiming, not Wicca), I'd start with Elen Hawke's _In the Circle_, Jennifer Hunter's _21st Century Wicca_, or Thea Sabine's _Wicca for Beginners_ (this last one's not mentioned on that page, as I only recently got my hands on my own copy.)

For witchcraft for someone who is not settled on Wiccan-based material, I'd start with Marion Green's _A Witch Alone_, or Starhawk and Hilary Valentine's _Twelve Wild Swans_ (which is clearer about where and how the political stuff fits, easier to avoid for people who want to avoid it, and has a nicely structured approach to exercises and things to learn,)

[Waldfrau]

Thanks, it's sometimes hard for me to decide which book to read next.

[rose]

My take on it (I'm familiar with our local Reclaiming community, was part of a project run under their umbrella, though many of the other participants weren't Reclaiming folk either, and have had lengthy conversations with several people in it, but it's not where I spend much time) is that the political bit is a constant undercurrent.

However, how that manifests for particular people and situations varies a whole lot - some people do small things through their life (recycling, daily choices), and some people are more devoted to various big causes. Personally, I've found the Reclaiming things I've done at the edge of my comfort level for structural reasons, not political-focus ones, but I freely admit I prefer structure (and specific kinds of structure, in particular). That said, I've *liked* all the serious Reclaiming folk I know as people, and as witches, and enjoy conversations and interactions with them a lot; they have not been people who only talk about politics, or who expect everyone to take their exact same views.

yes, I agree. As a person who works with Reclaiming people a lot (I'm in the Spiral Choir this year for Spiral Dance..that should be interesting ) I have to say that I have not yet met anyone who is initiated and really committed to the program who isn't smart, interesting and pretty well-grounded and fun to be around. A woman I took an Elements class with a while back, who had been around Reclaiming for a while described them as "unusually socially skilled, for Pagans"

[Tags:]

Jump to: Please select a destination: ----------------------------- About The Cauldron ----------------------------- => Rules and Regulations => Cauldron Announcements ===> Volunteers Needed: Site Assistants and Projects => Introductions => Board Questions, Suggestions, and Feedback => Chat and CauldronMUX Support => Test Board ----------------------------- Religion and Philosophy ----------------------------- => Paganism For Beginners => Books and Other Resources => Pagan Religions => Pagan Spirituality => Gods, Goddesses, and Mythology => Worship and Ritual => Holidays and Festivals => History and Religion => Faith in Everyday Life => Philosophy and Metaphysics => Non-Pagan Religions and Interfaith Discussions => Miscellaneous Religious Discussions ----------------------------- Magic and the Occult ----------------------------- => Magic and the Occult for Beginners => Witchcraft, Hoodoo, and Folk Magic => The Western Magical Tradition => Chaos Magic => Lodges and Other Magic Organizations => Miscellaneous Magical Discussions ----------------------------- Special Interest Groups & Special Discussions ----------------------------- => Special Topic Discussions => Chavi Memorial Chronic Illness SIG => General SIGS ===> College Pagans SIG ===> Cooking SIG ===> Divination SIG ===> Home and Garden SIG ===> Pagan Parents SIG ===> Teen Pagans SIG => Religious SIGS ===> Asatru and Heathenry SIG ===> Cauldron Cill ===> FlameKeeping SIG ===> Hazel and Oak: A Celtic Polytheism SIG ===> Neo-Druidry SIG ===> Reformed Kemeticism SIG ===> Ta Hiera Hellenic Polytheism SIG => Book/Media Discussion Boards ===> Academic Book Discussions ===> Pagan Religion Book Discussions ===> Magick Book Discussions ===> Fiction Book Discussions ===> DVD/Video Discussions ----------------------------- Life, the Universe, and Everything Else ----------------------------- => Pagan Announcements => Prayer and Energy Requests => News and Politics ===> Religious News ===> Non-Religious News ===> Political Discussions => Social Discussion Boards ===> Art, Poetry and Writing ===> Books ===> Computers and the Internet ===> Crafts and Hobbies ===> Family Life ===> Gaming ===> Health and Medicine ===> Humor and Quizzes ===> Music, Television, and Film ===> Pets ===> Science and Technology ===> Sports and Recreation