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Author Topic: Your religion, or your magic?  (Read 26916 times)
semperfemme
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« Reply #75: October 15, 2008, 09:40:57 am »

...Which came first?

Did you practice magic before you found/developed your religious path? Or did you already have your religious leanings before you began to delve into magic?

I believe I practiced magic before I got around to religion. Probably because a lot of my source material stressed magic while glossing over everything else.

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In your own personal view of things, is the one in direct correlation with the other? Or do you view them as completely separate things? Why?

In my mind they are two separate things. Magic to me is a practice, heck I'd almost call it a sure shot; because like practicing anything the more you put into it, the more time you spend, the more your learn, and the more you DO, the better and more effective you become. Magic is more about doing for the self.

Religion, to me, is about building a relationship with a particular deity. So in my mind, it isn't the place to be "making requests", though many religions do this.

That's just my point of view however.
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« Reply #76: October 16, 2008, 09:55:44 am »

...Which came first?

In your own personal view of things, is the one in direct correlation with the other? Or do you view them as completely separate things? Why?
For me, the magic, but only by a little bit. The two have been closely intertwined for me for as long as I've been doing this. It's very much a circular thing. I started with magic, but that led me to try and create a framework for my experiences, a way to perceive the magic within my own life. In turn, the more ideas I gathered about religion, the more I was able to understand and work with magic, which led to me creating more of a background for it. It's very much a snowball effect, and I expect it to keep going.

Actually, one of my current adventures is to try and examine the two separate from each other to gain a new perspective on what I'm doing. It's problematic so far! I guess I've always linked the two in my mind, so pulling them apart is haaaard.
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« Reply #77: October 16, 2008, 11:03:06 am »

...Which came first?

To answer the original question, my curiosity about magic started my interest in Pagan religions, but I didn't practice magic until I started on my current spiritual path, andhad learned a thing or to about the hows and whys. For me, magic is a benefit? that my "religion" gives me guidelines on how to practice. *note: I qualify religion because I don't follow one specific religion exclusively.
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« Reply #78: October 21, 2008, 10:48:12 pm »

...Which came first?

Did you practice magic before you found/developed your religious path? Or did you already have your religious leanings before you began to delve into magic?

In your own personal view of things, is the one in direct correlation with the other? Or do you view them as completely separate things? Why?

I started doing magic when I was young and didn't realise it was magic. I was approached by a family friend who was Wiccan who lent me some of her books. I read them briefly but didn't fully understand (being 10 at the time). I have always seen strange things and said a well-wishing prayer to someone who has eventually gotten well indicating "magick" to the point of putting my energy out to them.

But, considering that I don't know the official term of magick very well and don't want to revel too much of my ignorance towards it I will break it down to this: Special things were happening to me in life and then I decided to read more on it do I believe that magick was happening before I put belief/religion into it.

I sure hope that made sense. Cheesy
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oonagh
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« Reply #79: October 24, 2008, 12:45:37 pm »

...Which came first?

Did you practice magic before you found/developed your religious path? Or did you already have your religious leanings before you began to delve into magic?

In your own personal view of things, is the one in direct correlation with the other? Or do you view them as completely separate things? Why?

what an interesting thread this is.
i do not practice magic and i am a pagan (not wiccan). i view magic as something that happens on its own (miracle, perhaps?). we cannot do magic. we can do ceremony and we can pray and we can ask and hope for magic, but we do not do it.

i think that many religions have "superficial" trappings that are *very* similar, but that mean various things. when these trappings are taken too seriously, there is trouble. catholics *did* believe that the wine was magically turned into blood at the altar in the church.  they didn't care if it tasted like wine it *was*, after the magic, blood (i was raised congregationalist...we had banana bread and grape juice <g>). to say otherwise was not, well, wise.
people need "superficial" trappings in order to help us bring ourselves out of the every day. are they magic? not in the sense that they make anything happen. are they magic? yes, in the sense that they create something special for us (ambiance).
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oonagh
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« Reply #80: October 24, 2008, 01:49:37 pm »

catholics *did* believe that the wine was magically turned into blood at the altar in the church.  they didn't care if it tasted like wine it *was*, after the magic, blood .... to say otherwise was not, well, wise.

Um, not exactly. The Catholic Church uses a neo-Platonic/Aristotelean description of what's occurring. The "accidents" of the bread and wine -- their outer matter -- remain bread and wine. The "substance" of the bread and wine -- their essence, or soul, or true being -- becomes body and blood. But it's not tangible or sensible, in the sense that one cannot interact with the "substance" with one's senses. One always interacts physically with the "accidents." One is ridiculous, if not outright heretical, if one claims one is interacting with "accidents" that have become body and blood. It's SUPPOSED to taste like bread and wine. To claim otherwise is a) absurd and b) missing the point.

And I understood this pretty thoroughly when I was seven, before I made my first communion. It's not particularly tricky and doesn't require a genius.
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oonagh
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« Reply #81: October 24, 2008, 02:32:13 pm »

And I understood this pretty thoroughly when I was seven, before I made my first communion. It's not particularly tricky and doesn't require a genius

i bow to your expertise. that being said, my point is my point.
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oonagh
Hufflee
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« Reply #82: October 24, 2008, 02:40:17 pm »

i do not practice magic and i am a pagan (not wiccan). i view magic as something that happens on its own (miracle, perhaps?). we cannot do magic. we can do ceremony and we can pray and we can ask and hope for magic, but we do not do it.

You don't believe that there is part of the creator in all of us? Being raised Catholic I would think that this would be true. (I was raised Non-Denominational Christian) If part of God or Goddess or whatever you want to call the higher power is within us, and he/she/it is the one that actually deos the magic, what makes you think we can't tap into that?

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« Reply #83: October 24, 2008, 03:34:51 pm »

You don't believe that there is part of the creator in all of us? Being raised Catholic I would think that this would be true. (I was raised Non-Denominational Christian) If part of God or Goddess or whatever you want to call the higher power is within us, and he/she/it is the one that actually deos the magic, what makes you think we can't tap into that?



i believe that spirit is in the center of all things, not that we can control it. i just don't believe that we can.

what makes you think i was raised catholic?
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oonagh
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« Reply #84: October 24, 2008, 04:24:43 pm »

i believe that spirit is in the center of all things, not that we can control it. i just don't believe that we can.

what makes you think i was raised catholic?

I mistyped that, sorry. You said Congregationalist. But, as I understand it, Congregationals are Protestant, which hold to the fact that the Bible is written pretty much as something not to be messed with; that there is only one true interpretation of the bible, and that's the literal one. If I'm mistaken I apologize.

Your beliefs are OK with me. I was just curious.
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« Reply #85: October 24, 2008, 06:03:59 pm »

i view magic as something that happens on its own (miracle, perhaps?). we cannot do magic. we can do ceremony and we can pray and we can ask and hope for magic, but we do not do it.

For me, at least. there is a huge difference being doing magic and praying or asking for a miracle. When I do magic, I cause something to happen. When I pray, ask someone else to cause something to happen.
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Hufflee
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« Reply #86: October 24, 2008, 06:45:27 pm »

For me, at least. there is a huge difference being doing magic and praying or asking for a miracle. When I do magic, I cause something to happen. When I pray, ask someone else to cause something to happen.

couldn't have said it better myself!
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oonagh
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« Reply #87: October 25, 2008, 02:46:45 pm »

When I do magic, I cause something to happen.

i guess i don't believe that we can cause something to happen.
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oonagh
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« Reply #88: October 25, 2008, 06:59:06 pm »

i guess i don't believe that we can cause something to happen.

In what regard?

You hit post, and your post appeared.  At what point does ability to cause change in the world disappear?
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« Reply #89: October 25, 2008, 10:07:22 pm »

i guess i don't believe that we can cause something to happen.

We can do so without magic, so I don't see why we can't with magic.
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