How long we been around?

The Cauldron's server is expensive and requires monthly payments. Please become a Bronze, Silver or Gold Donor if you can. Donations are needed every month. Without member support, we can't afford the server.

Or donate directly via Paypal

This message board is The Cauldron: A Pagan Forum's SMF Archive Board. It is closed to new memberships and to posting, but there are over 250,000 messages here that you can still search and read -- many full of interesting and useful information. (This board was open from February 2007 through June 2011).

Our new vBulletin discussion board is located at http://www.ecauldron.com/forum/ -- if you would like to participate in discussions like those you see here, please visit our new vBulletin message board, register an account and join in our discussions. We hope you will find the information in this message archive useful and will consider joining us on our new board.

[INsearch]

What are you guys views on this?  Their seems to be allot of people that think we have been around a million years and earth several billion years!  Why do we come to this conclusion?  because science says so?  I know I am not Christian anymore but I still hold to the idea that Earth is sooooooo much younger than stated what are you guys opinion?

[LyricFox]

What are you guys views on this?  Their seems to be allot of people that think we have been around a million years and earth several billion years!  Why do we come to this conclusion?  because science says so?  I know I am not Christian anymore but I still hold to the idea that Earth is sooooooo much younger than stated what are you guys opinion?

Unless someone can come up with something that can scientifically disprove what science has come up with for dating, I see no reason to disbelieve the billions of years thing.

Then again, you'll also find I'm one of those people who just really doesn't care. I'm here now. Not then. How I got here has never been something that concerned me. Randall, OTOH, will happily chatter on about this stuff forever...just not with me.  So if someone was able to prove a "date", I'd probably just say, "That's nice." and go on doing what I was doing.

[INsearch]

Sorry if I cant site at the moment what I am going to "try" to explain but I myself just see some flaws in all this.  I think that the Earth maybe around 10,000 years... yeah    about ten thousand years    Wow people wont like that view huh?  hmmmm well thats what I have to say at the moment I guess?  about like ten thousand years old maybe a little older.

[FierFlye]

Sorry if I cant site at the moment what I am going to "try" to explain but I myself just see some flaws in all this.  I think that the Earth maybe around 10,000 years... yeah    about ten thousand years    Wow people wont like that view huh?  hmmmm well thats what I have to say at the moment I guess?  about like ten thousand years old maybe a little older.

What makes you come to that conclusion? 

[LyricFox]

Sorry if I cant site at the moment what I am going to "try" to explain but I myself just see some flaws in all this.  I think that the Earth maybe around 10,000 years... yeah    about ten thousand years    Wow people wont like that view huh?  hmmmm well thats what I have to say at the moment I guess?  about like ten thousand years old maybe a little older.

Well, InSearch, the only ones I know who think that are young earth creationists. If they want to think that way, fine. But the evidence is overwhelmingly to the contrary. Now, if you want to join them, go right ahead. Just don't expect that other people in the forum will line up behind you.

[INsearch]

What makes you come to that conclusion? 

I guess it comes with my up brining in Christianity.  Although I reject it now they brought up allot of Good points some stuff that just seemed to prove the whole earth is billions of years old thing.  I cant really explain why I feel this.  Tho it would require belief in the Bible to make it true.  But.... I dunno.

[INsearch]

Well, InSearch, the only ones I know who think that are young earth creationists. If they want to think that way, fine. But the evidence is overwhelmingly to the contrary. Now, if you want to join them, go right ahead. Just don't expect that other people in the forum will line up behind you.

I feel kinda contrary to this.... I admit that some stuff they have come up with could be true and are.  I think their are some good points "young earth creationists"  have come up with   

Edit:  Why would I be expecting anyone to line up behind me?  I feel I will probably be the only one with this view, I just want to discuss.

[HeartShadow - Cutethulhu]

I feel kinda contrary to this.... I admit that some stuff they have come up with could be true and are.  I think their are some good points "young earth creationists"  have come up with   

Edit:  Why would I be expecting anyone to line up behind me?  I feel I will probably be the only one with this view, I just want to discuss.

All I can say is, learn some geology.

Carbon dating is real - and that dates stuff back WAY farther.  Strata dating of things in the fossil record is real.  "Intelligent design" and young earth creationism holds water about as well as a sieve.  It's just got a lot of money behind it because the people pushing it have a serious agenda and don't give a crap what they're doing to the science education of our children.

Now, if you want to believe something that's garbage, that's your choice.  But don't get a flu shot - because the only reason we keep needing new ones of those is evolution.

[FierFlye]

I guess it comes with my up brining in Christianity.  Although I reject it now they brought up allot of Good points some stuff that just seemed to prove the whole earth is billions of years old thing.  I cant really explain why I feel this.  Tho it would require belief in the Bible to make it true.  But.... I dunno.

So you are just pulling a random number out a hat?  I mean, why 10,000 years?  Why not 9,000 or 12,000?  

Now, I don't have any bets going on how old the earth is, so your opinion on it's age doesn't personally upset me.  But when people deny strong evidence that is staring them in the face, it kind of makes me want to beat them over the head with one of those foam pool noodles.

It would be like if I suddenly starting proclaiming I thought the sun revolves around the earth.  I have no evidence to support this, and scientific evidence strongly proves otherwise, but hey-it sounds like a good theory to me, so, I'm gonna go with it.

[INsearch]

All I can say is, learn some geology.

Carbon dating is real - and that dates stuff back WAY farther.  Strata dating of things in the fossil record is real.  "Intelligent design" and young earth creationism holds water about as well as a sieve.  It's just got a lot of money behind it because the people pushing it have a serious agenda and don't give a crap what they're doing to the science education of our children.

Now, if you want to believe something that's garbage, that's your choice.  But don't get a flu shot - because the only reason we keep needing new ones of those is evolution.

I don't see whats up with the hostility I didn't do anything wrong.  Nor did I provoke anyone.  Honestly I think creating can hold up quiet a good amount of water in my opinion.  How did this stuff all get here?  It requires just as much faith to believe everything we have came from Chaos and Nothing at all as it is to believe in some divine creator. 

[Mithril]

I don't see whats up with the hostility I didn't do anything wrong.  Nor did I provoke anyone.  Honestly I think creating can hold up quiet a good amount of water in my opinion.  How did this stuff all get here?  It requires just as much faith to believe everything we have came from Chaos and Nothing at all as it is to believe in some divine creator. 

That's not really what the issue is here. The issue is timescale. Nobody's saying that there definitely wasn't a creation, nobody could know that, all we're saying is that it was WAY longer ago than 10 000.

The problem I have with young earth creationists is that they tend to get in the way of education. For example, I'm sure several of the creationist kids in my school have failed at least one semester of biology because they refuse to study the chapter on evolution.

[INsearch]

because they refuse to study the chapter on evolution.

Well its going against their personal beliefs.  I will get back to you guys with some stuff granted it will be Christian in orientation but it uses "real" science to explain (usually without mentioning the bible at all) why they have a beef against evolution and all kinds of stuff including how old the earth is tho you would please give me some time?  keep discussing among yourselves tho.  (not that their will be much to discuss since you all seem to have the same beliefs about this lol)

[OpenHands]

What are you guys views on this?  Their seems to be allot of people that think we have been around a million years and earth several billion years!  Why do we come to this conclusion?  because science says so?  I know I am not Christian anymore but I still hold to the idea that Earth is sooooooo much younger than stated what are you guys opinion?

Religion and science mesh well for me, always have.  I came from a more mainline church though (United Methodist) and we were told in Sunday school classes that each "day" of creation to God could have been millions of years to a human.  So I have no doubt that carbon dating and other ways we figure out how old stuff is, is fairly accurate.  What exactly are your thoughts on fossils and such? 

The biggest issue I have with people trying to prove creationism is that they're not using scientific methods.  You don't start out with your conclusion and work backwards trying to prove it.  That's not science, that's an attempt to justify a literal interpretation of a set of ancient scriptures.

Much like the fuss over trying to "prove" that the world did actually flood and you can find remains of an ark sitting on top of a mountain somewhere.  I guess those people aren't aware that you can find flood stories throughout the ancient near east?  (Like in Mesopotamia where the story goes that the gods got sick of the noise and overpopulation of humanity and sent a flood to rectify the situation.  Only a sage and his wife survived because a god instructed them to build an ark.  Very popular story even before Genesis came about.)

- OpenHands

[HeartShadow - Cutethulhu]

I don't see whats up with the hostility I didn't do anything wrong.  Nor did I provoke anyone.  Honestly I think creating can hold up quiet a good amount of water in my opinion.  How did this stuff all get here?  It requires just as much faith to believe everything we have came from Chaos and Nothing at all as it is to believe in some divine creator. 

it irritates me because it's CRAP "science".  Mostly it's CRAP.  CRAP CRAP CRAP.  And it's harmful crap, too - because when you get rid of evolution, geology, and half of physics from the curriculum, that pretty much guts everything else.

Are we created?  Maybe.  Is Genesis literally true?  Not unless God really likes playing silly buggers with scientists.  (possible, evidence does not point that way).

My religion thinks that truth and logical thought are vastly important.  Seeking truth with an open mind (but not an empty one) is a Good.  Knowledge is a Good.  Holding to theories that make about as much sense as the idea that flapping your arms makes you a bird is BAD.

You can believe whatever the hell you want.  But this subject will NEVER fail to do anything other than irritate me, and that's because it's hamstringing an entire damn generation of students into crap concepts of reality and science.  It's helping us fall behind the rest of the world (Where people aren't as fucking stupid - do you really think they teach this shit in Germany?  I guarantee you not).

You can believe we were all created five minutes ago, or that you're the only real and this is all happening in your head, or that my toenail is the entire purpose of the universe.  But don't try to pass it off as science, because it isn't.  And there's no proof to it.  AT ALL.

[HeartShadow - Cutethulhu]

Well its going against their personal beliefs.  I will get back to you guys with some stuff granted it will be Christian in orientation but it uses "real" science to explain (usually without mentioning the bible at all) why they have a beef against evolution and all kinds of stuff including how old the earth is tho you would please give me some time?  keep discussing among yourselves tho.  (not that their will be much to discuss since you all seem to have the same beliefs about this lol)

oooh, does your proof include the drowning fish?

I've always loved the drowning fish.  In different sedimentary layers.

It's my favorite.

[Tags:]

Jump to: Please select a destination: ----------------------------- About The Cauldron ----------------------------- => Rules and Regulations => Cauldron Announcements ===> Volunteers Needed: Site Assistants and Projects => Introductions => Board Questions, Suggestions, and Feedback => Chat and CauldronMUX Support => Test Board ----------------------------- Religion and Philosophy ----------------------------- => Paganism For Beginners => Books and Other Resources => Pagan Religions => Pagan Spirituality => Gods, Goddesses, and Mythology => Worship and Ritual => Holidays and Festivals => History and Religion => Faith in Everyday Life => Philosophy and Metaphysics => Non-Pagan Religions and Interfaith Discussions => Miscellaneous Religious Discussions ----------------------------- Magic and the Occult ----------------------------- => Magic and the Occult for Beginners => Witchcraft, Hoodoo, and Folk Magic => The Western Magical Tradition => Chaos Magic => Lodges and Other Magic Organizations => Miscellaneous Magical Discussions ----------------------------- Special Interest Groups & Special Discussions ----------------------------- => Special Topic Discussions => Chavi Memorial Chronic Illness SIG => General SIGS ===> College Pagans SIG ===> Cooking SIG ===> Divination SIG ===> Home and Garden SIG ===> Pagan Parents SIG ===> Teen Pagans SIG => Religious SIGS ===> Asatru and Heathenry SIG ===> Cauldron Cill ===> FlameKeeping SIG ===> Hazel and Oak: A Celtic Polytheism SIG ===> Neo-Druidry SIG ===> Reformed Kemeticism SIG ===> Ta Hiera Hellenic Polytheism SIG => Book/Media Discussion Boards ===> Academic Book Discussions ===> Pagan Religion Book Discussions ===> Magick Book Discussions ===> Fiction Book Discussions ===> DVD/Video Discussions ----------------------------- Life, the Universe, and Everything Else ----------------------------- => Pagan Announcements => Prayer and Energy Requests => News and Politics ===> Religious News ===> Non-Religious News ===> Political Discussions => Social Discussion Boards ===> Art, Poetry and Writing ===> Books ===> Computers and the Internet ===> Crafts and Hobbies ===> Family Life ===> Gaming ===> Health and Medicine ===> Humor and Quizzes ===> Music, Television, and Film ===> Pets ===> Science and Technology ===> Sports and Recreation