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Author Topic: Shape of a cast circle  (Read 8652 times)
Waldfrau
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« Reply #30: February 12, 2009, 12:42:47 pm »

Sorry for answering so late. I did read your reply earlier, but got distracted while thinking about an answer.

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And, to be fair, not everyone is very good at explaining it - or can do it off the top of their head. (Explaining how my trad's circle works is.. well, several months worth of training for our Dedicants. I *can* do a condensed version for people with general background, and showing it definitely helps there - but there will be all sorts of bits and pieces that aren't obvious just from what we say - they have to do with the visualisations, energy flow, etc. that won't just be picked up from a single experience of the circle.
To be honest, you explain stuff very well even if you only write a few sentences (and you often write more). A lot of Cauldronites do explain stuff very well. So at first I thought I was just expecting too much because rl-conversation is much different from TC.

But I've been with the group for roughly 3 months and conversations went worse instead of improving. At the beginning there was a lot of curiousity on both sides and everyone tried to explain his/her point of view, but then everything started to go in circles. It's not anyone's fault, I just think I don't really fit into the group because I want answers about stuff they've just never thought about why they do something the way they do. And they get frustrated because I'm keeping asking questions they can't answer. I know I'm not an easy student and have to learn some patience and ease, but I can only restrain myself so much and people who do things just because they feel good to them or because that's the way those things or obviously done (what they have read in the first 101 book) are too much for my little amount of patience even if I try very hard.

So I've started to study occassionally with another newbie. She can't answer questions either, but I think her mind works a similar way and so she enjoys discussing questions what my former group didn't. I don't expect people to give me 'The Truth', but I get frustrated if they don't like to explore different ideas and block discussions. I don't blame them. May they find happiness in their way of life.
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Jenett
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« Reply #31: February 12, 2009, 04:36:32 pm »

But I've been with the group for roughly 3 months and conversations went worse instead of improving. At the beginning there was a lot of curiousity on both sides and everyone tried to explain his/her point of view, but then everything started to go in circles. It's not anyone's fault, I just think I don't really fit into the group because I want answers about stuff they've just never thought about why they do something the way they do. And they get frustrated because I'm keeping asking questions they can't answer.

One of the things my covenmate and I have been talking around this year is about how it's not just about liking people - but about the kinds of conversations you want to have with them. There were many things I liked about conversations with the group I trained with - but there were also places where either I wanted to geek out, and go into far more intricate detail than they were interested in, or where our communication styles just weren't a really good mesh in a particular area.

Dealing with that was good for me - but it's also made me really delight in work with my covenmate - she and I are extremely well matched in how we prefer to talk through things, and it's made the conversations incredibly meaningful, but also very efficient. (We keep going "I thought this would take hours!" and it takes us 20 minutes.)

I think that TC tends to attract people who actively enjoy geeking out about not only the ritual/magical/etc. processes, but also the *process* of talking about them. Many of us are what one of my friends refers to as 'verbally adept' - we write pretty fluently, and we take some pains to come across clearly about complex subjects.

Some people just don't have that particular desire - the HPS who trained me is one of them. She's a fabulous witch and priestess, but trying to get certain kinds of discussion going with her is very hard going. And not everyone has the skills - some people don't think quickly on their feet with new questions, but are great in a formal teaching situation, for example, and others need to work through an explanation in advance before trying it out with people who don't know the subject.

And skills build different *kinds* of group work. A group with 3 or 4 longstanding members who are confident in different skills will create a different set of community spaces than a group where it's all skewed in a particular direction.

(I've got no illusions about this: I'm *very* good at immediate explanations of complex concepts: it's a skill I've developed partly because it's very useful for my profession and other things I'm interested in. But there's a lot of things I'm not good at, too. You all just don't see them, because most of them aren't obvious online. For one example, my former HPS can walk into a room of 20 people, and immediately create an energetic 'home'. I have to work much much harder to even approach that, and it always feels foreign and stilted to me.) 

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So I've started to study occassionally with another newbie. She can't answer questions either, but I think her mind works a similar way and so she enjoys discussing questions what my former group didn't. I don't expect people to give me 'The Truth', but I get frustrated if they don't like to explore different ideas and block discussions. I don't blame them. May they find happiness in their way of life.

This sounds most excellent - and it's not like it cuts you off from continuing to look at other options (like a mentor who has more experience, but wants to discuss the same kinds of things.).
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Matrinka
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« Reply #32: February 12, 2009, 08:40:17 pm »

I think that TC tends to attract people who actively enjoy geeking out about not only the ritual/magical/etc. processes, but also the *process* of talking about them. Many of us are what one of my friends refers to as 'verbally adept' - we write pretty fluently, and we take some pains to come across clearly about complex subjects.

I think that is why this forum, of all the many I once was a member of in the long-ago on Delphi, is the only one I followed and have rejoined.  It is that very trait- the desire to really discuss topics, to do so articulately, and even the occasional beating of dead horses- which draws me back here.
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Waldfrau
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« Reply #33: February 13, 2009, 06:55:46 am »

This sounds most excellent - and it's not like it cuts you off from continuing to look at other options (like a mentor who has more experience, but wants to discuss the same kinds of things.).
It's not easy to find a mentor. The group I was in was much more experienced than me, but didn't have any experience in teaching nor did they really want to teach. We all just thought I'd be able to catch up with some stuff by looking and doing. The flaw was that I focused on learning while they had more of a fellowship focus. They just wanted to have nice sabbats and I wanted personal development, reflect about what we're doing and why, to get in touch with mysteries... I must have annoyed them a great deal and the rebuffs I got didn't do my self-worth much good. But now I know a bit better what I want and need.

I think if there's really a focus on learning in a peer-group you can learn a lot even without a teacher, although a teacher would be preferable. But training with a teacher is much more of a commitment than celebrating a few sabbats with an eclectic group, so I think I should really know what I want (like if any and which tradition) before considering any formal training. But I'd love to attend open seeker classes or workshops if I can find any.
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ivy
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« Reply #34: February 13, 2009, 12:43:04 pm »


I'd like to know which methods you prefer and why. Would the first method be an incomplete circle or do you think it's necessary to leave it open to the ground and sky for grounding and connection?  Huh

Our group has cast circles of all kinds, including a Sacred Space, (this is especially helpful if you're casting in a livingroom or in a place outside without definition). This gives us an opening for the 'sky' and 'ground' so we can call on the spirits, (gods and goddesses) and expel negative energy.
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Sam_Hain
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« Reply #35: February 23, 2009, 06:43:37 am »

Hello!
         When I first started practicing I used the cyclinder method - mainly as I was very young and followed diagrams exactly without questioning them - falling into the trap set by our predecessors in grimoires for centuries! Then I practiced the "Spherical" mopre common Circle casting - and never saw a difference either way. I think the key was my mind set. Because I didn't "know" that a cyclinder Circle wouldn't contain energy or focus it, I never had an issue. Rather, I thought along the lines of my circle existing in every plane in a multidimensional reality - every Circle cast upon the floor as a cyclinder joining to create the classical "spherical" shape when seen from this perspective (If you could look at all realities all at the same time without your brain running out of your nose).
I suppose I still see the Circle existing in this way, regardless of how it's cast. I feel the important thing is what the Practitioner feels and thinks about it, because that is what will manifest.

BB guys

Sam_Hain
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EverFool
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« Reply #36: February 23, 2009, 07:26:36 am »


Sam_Hain,

Could you please remember to leave the quote code in when you respond to a thread?  Thank you!

EverFool
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