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Author Topic: Apollo's birthday  (Read 13368 times)
BGMarc
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« Topic Start: July 19, 2009, 06:48:43 pm »

Just wondering if modern dodekatheists still observe Apollo's birthday on the 7th day of Bysios, as per Plutarch? (No particular reason, I just hadn't come across it before and wondered Smiley)
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« Reply #1: July 19, 2009, 07:03:30 pm »

Just wondering if modern dodekatheists still observe Apollo's birthday on the 7th day of Bysios, as per Plutarch? (No particular reason, I just hadn't come across it before and wondered Smiley)

I don't, then again I don't follow any ancient calender because they, imo, are irrelevent to today.
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« Reply #2: July 19, 2009, 07:46:07 pm »

I don't, then again I don't follow any ancient calender because they, imo, are irrelevent to today.

Not disagreeing at all, but your response surprises me a little. What is your thinking behind the calendars all being irrelevant?
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« Reply #3: July 19, 2009, 07:59:44 pm »

Not disagreeing at all, but your response surprises me a little. What is your thinking behind the calendars all being irrelevant?

Well for starters, every region had its own religious calender.  Secondly all of them were lunar and it's a PITA trying to follow because its dates are not consistant with modern ones.  The one that is most intact is the Athenian Calender which wouldn't make sense to follow outside of Athens as quite a few of the holidays are civic in nature and not religious.
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« Reply #4: July 19, 2009, 08:58:49 pm »

Just wondering if modern dodekatheists still observe Apollo's birthday on the 7th day of Bysios, as per Plutarch? (No particular reason, I just hadn't come across it before and wondered Smiley)

The group I worship with observes 6th-7th Thargelion as both Apollo's and Artemis' birthdays.  Well, or the closest reasonable meeting day for the group, though the neokoros does the necessary temple rites on the actual days.  I'm not familiar with Bysios, but then, I'm not hugely familiar with Plutarch either.  I'm guessing Bysios is part of a different calendar than the Athenian?
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« Reply #5: July 19, 2009, 09:09:56 pm »

The group I worship with observes 6th-7th Thargelion as both Apollo's and Artemis' birthdays.  Well, or the closest reasonable meeting day for the group, though the neokoros does the necessary temple rites on the actual days.  I'm not familiar with Bysios, but then, I'm not hugely familiar with Plutarch either.  I'm guessing Bysios is part of a different calendar than the Athenian?

Bysios is what the Delphics called Pysios, which takes place in approximately January-February.
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« Reply #6: July 19, 2009, 09:21:57 pm »

Just wondering if modern dodekatheists still observe Apollo's birthday on the 7th day of Bysios, as per Plutarch? (No particular reason, I just hadn't come across it before and wondered Smiley)

I'm not familiar with Plutarch or the Delphic calendar, but I follow the Attic calendar and Apollo is honoured on the 7th day of every month (Artemis on the 6th). Like firelfy124 said, the Thagelia festival on the 6th and 7th of Thargelion (around the month of May) is celebrated as the birthday of Apollo and Artemis, or the first fruits offering to them.
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« Reply #7: July 19, 2009, 10:15:04 pm »

Bysios is what the Delphics called Pysios, which takes place in approximately January-February.

Interesting!  *ponders*  It would make more sense, in some ways, to follow the Delphic calendar wrt Apollo rather than the Athenian.  Though even trying to keep the Athenian versus modern calendars straight is frustrating at times.
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« Reply #8: July 19, 2009, 10:20:51 pm »

Well for starters, every region had its own religious calender.  Secondly all of them were lunar and it's a PITA trying to follow because its dates are not consistant with modern ones.  The one that is most intact is the Athenian Calender which wouldn't make sense to follow outside of Athens as quite a few of the holidays are civic in nature and not religious.


I prefer the Athenian Calendar myself. I don't find it difficult to follow; a number of websites provide us with the Hellenic Month Established Per Athens (HMEPA, the Athenian sacred calendar) free-of-charge.

Sure, one might want to observe some of the seasonal festivals in another month if the Athenian climate is radically different from one's own. However, even the civic festivals of the Polis religion often seem to involve honoring one or more of the Immortals. I may not be a farmer or a soldier, but I'm still grateful for Demeter's gifts and Athene's blessings.

I'm certainly not making the argument that the HMEPA is the only legitimate calendar of religious observance for Hellenic polytheists. It simply provides a link to the past, and offers a ready-made schedule of holy days and festivals for those of us who make daily sacrifice to the Deathless Ones. It also reminds us that the deities whom we feel closest to, may not be the only Goddesses and Gods worth honoring.

Additionally, the HMEPA connects us with our co-religionists in Greece, who frequently follow it.
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« Reply #9: July 19, 2009, 10:44:31 pm »

I'm not familiar with Plutarch or the Delphic calendar, but I follow the Attic calendar and Apollo is honoured on the 7th day of every month...

At the time Plutarch was writing (he lived AD 46 – 120) he reports that it is a relatively recent innovation for the Oracle to speak on a monthly basis and that previously oracles had only been given on Apollo's birthday each year. I wonder if the two facts are at all linked.
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« Reply #10: July 19, 2009, 10:50:31 pm »


I prefer the Athenian Calendar myself. I don't find it difficult to follow; a number of websites provide us with the Hellenic Month Established Per Athens (HMEPA, the Athenian sacred calendar) free-of-charge.

Sure, one might want to observe some of the seasonal festivals in another month if the Athenian climate is radically different from one's own. However, even the civic festivals of the Polis religion often seem to involve honoring one or more of the Immortals. I may not be a farmer or a soldier, but I'm still grateful for Demeter's gifts and Athene's blessings.

I'm certainly not making the argument that the HMEPA is the only legitimate calendar of religious observance for Hellenic polytheists. It simply provides a link to the past, and offers a ready-made schedule of holy days and festivals for those of us who make daily sacrifice to the Deathless Ones. It also reminds us that the deities whom we feel closest to, may not be the only Goddesses and Gods worth honoring.

Additionally, the HMEPA connects us with our co-religionists in Greece, who frequently follow it.

Frankly, I just don't care.  I don't live anywhere near Greece.  While some might want to try to take an ancient calender specific to one region and make it fit to thier climate, I find it easier to just create a new one from scratch that is relevent to my life.
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« Reply #11: July 19, 2009, 10:56:11 pm »

While some might want to try to take an ancient calender specific to one region and make it fit to thier climate, I find it easier to just create a new one from scratch that is relevent to my life.

That makes absolute sense to me (no surprise after a lifetime of Australian 'wiccans' trying to do the northern hemisphere Wheel of the Year), but how about the festival dates that refer to specific events, such as a birthday?
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« Reply #12: July 19, 2009, 11:45:11 pm »

That makes absolute sense to me (no surprise after a lifetime of Australian 'wiccans' trying to do the northern hemisphere Wheel of the Year), but how about the festival dates that refer to specific events, such as a birthday?

I generally ignore them.  I use the system that a few of us put together a couple of years ago in this thread.  Basically, I honor all the gods on the first Sunday of each month, individual Olympians have the second Sunday dedicated to hir and I honor various non-Olympians on the third.  Sure, they are not birthdays, but since birthdays are typically thought of as festivals/feast days I think I'm covered.
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« Reply #13: July 20, 2009, 05:12:15 am »



There is a good comparison table here that shows the Attican, Spartan, Boetian, Delphic and Cretan calendars side by side (months only, not festivals).
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It's the saddest thing in the world when you can only feel big by making others feel small. - UPG

Stupidity cannot be cured. Stupidity is the only universal capital crime. The sentence is death. There is no appeal and sentence is carried out automatically and without pity. Lazarus Long.

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« Reply #14: July 20, 2009, 07:57:52 am »

I prefer the Athenian Calendar myself. I don't find it difficult to follow; a number of websites provide us with the Hellenic Month Established Per Athens (HMEPA, the Athenian sacred calendar) free-of-charge.

It is easily available, but that doesn't translate into "easy to follow", at least for me personally.  I am completely unattuned to the lunar calendar.  I never have any idea where we're at on it without going and checking, and I never remember what's coming up when because "7 Thargelion" means absolutely zip to me in terms of "this is when this is happening".

I'm still figuring out calendars.  I could see maybe sticking to HMEPA or one of the other Greek calendars for major festivals, the sorts of things that come around once each year.  For monthly observances, though, it makes a lot more sense to me to use the calendar that I'm used to.   My understanding (someone correct me if I'm wrong) is that the calendars followed by the ancients were not "special" religious calendars; these were the calendars their lives were run on, whether that meant scheduling religious observances or civic duties or whatever.  As I see it, it makes sense for me to follow suit and use the civic calendar that dictates my life rather than trying to keep separate calendars for religion and "the rest of my life".
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